12 September 2013

Tin Soldiers of Antwerp have Stolen 'LOKI'


I really do not know if I should be pleased or angry at having seen this poster for Crisis in Antwerp this year. I will thank James for spotting it though.

What is very clear is my 'Loki' identity has been nicked, stolen,pilfered, lifted, tea leafed or any other name you want to give it and used for a commercial purpose without my permission. While on the one hand I am really pleased someone thinks my work is worthy of display for such an important event, on the other I am angry that I was not asked if it could be used for this purpose. I also have not been given an all expenses paid trip to said event as a payment for using my image and stealing my identity!!!

Yes you did read it right my image, when we take or create our images we automatically create a copyright, they belong to us as individuals, just because we post them to the net does not make them freely usable to the wider public.  You cant use them unless you have explicit permission from the creator of the image, or comply with the terms of a rights statement, in either case if you are unclear you must contact the image creator, the copyright owner or the website owner.

Now that may seem a bit petty but that character painted by me is my persona and identity on the Internet for this very blog,  any forums I frequent etc he features heavily. You only have to type my name Andrew 'loki' Saunders into a Google search and he appears straight away. Now I do realise this also means that the image appears in Google if you search hard enough not using my name as well but which ever way you cut it the images lead back here and I am freely contactable. If they had visited then they would have been able to read my copyright notice too which says no commercial use. Being a war gamer they could have asked me if it was alright for them to use it and I probably would have not been bothered in fact quite the opposite.

Right now however I am very ANGRY and as gnarly as a cantankerous Viking can get where is my F++kin axe!!

So now I have a dilemma do I request that they stop using the image in their posters and any other places it appears, do I impose my copyright and demand a fee for using it? or should I be quietly very impressed, that my work is deemed to be of good enough quality to promote what is after all a very big event in the war games calendar? what would you do?

Right that is it rant over for now I am off to calm down by order of the wife!!!

49 comments:

  1. I think a wee line asking them if the do realise that its your painted mini they are using on their commercial literature would be interesting. maybe get some freebies?

    Buddies of mine have directed me a couple of times to eBay auctions that have used my painted figs to sell unpainted figures. Flattered but a bit of a cheek.

    Good luck.

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    1. Thats not good to hear either, but ebay is notorious for breaches like this. I shall drop them a message

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  2. Maybe a quiet word in their ear (or an email) is appropiate. copywright is only any good if it is enforced. It may well be an 'honest' mistake on their part but Its still worth challenging.

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    1. I will challenge it, as this one is quite personal to me!

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  3. Lovely painting by the way, worthy of many a poster!

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    1. Thank you. It is my personal favourite and I spent a lot of time on him.

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  4. Knowing the guys from the Tin Soldiers for over a decade, the one thing I can say for sure is that they will not have done so with any malicious intend.
    I know that the preparations for the even involve a lots of people with interlinked responsibilities. I would assume, that the person who did the layout will probably have assumed that the person who chose the images had asked for permission and that the person who chose the images assumed the designer would.
    Not nice for you, but I guess they just made an honest mistake there.

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    1. It may not have been malicious and I am sure it was not.
      However assumptions are no excuse for this breach, I would not have had an issue had I been asked after all I am a gamer and painter and would have been flattered. It was just a shock to see him so prominently displayed.

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    2. I know what you mean. And i really hope they work this one out!

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  5. I have already let you know my feelings but its your fault for painting so well :)

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  6. They could of asked eh? Then this would all be far easier for them! I say go kick down there doors! If they not got the decency to respect a wargamers work then they clearly dont have much of a connection with the community!

    Glad for you but also get the irritation!

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  7. "expenses paid trip to said event as a payment" would be appropriate.

    At least some sort of compensation/payment especially as this wasn´t one of all your pictures it was THE ONE picture!

    I realy hope they realize how clumsy they have acted not to check that they got writen permission to use your picture.

    Please let us know what responce you get from them and Good Luck with you battle;)

    Best regards Michael

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    1. Michael,you have hit the nail on the head it is the ONE picture and I will keep you posted on any response I get to this.
      Regards
      Loki

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  8. I would drop a line and ask for clarification. My reaction would how they behave in the end. I am curious how they will react, since our wargamers community isn't that big and stuff like that will go through blogs and the like.

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    1. Thanks, and I agree my response will be based on their reply I think its more of an issue being that particular image.

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  9. I think the quite word approach is the best. Better leave the axes and men in wigs in reserve. Not that I've blaming you for being irritated - it's an image that you've chosen to be 'you' and one that you've worked on accordingly. In a small community, that matters.

    Frankly, it's the sort of thing one would expect from the poster of an event held by a local club in a church hall. But who knows, if they're nice guys at least you've made contact!

    Next year in Antwerp!

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    1. I like the idea of next year in Antwerp for me and a few others. That is the whole point it is my adopted persona and it does matter to me at least

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  10. It is a violation of copyright law to use your work without your permission and without giving you credit as the source. I do think you should contact them to let them know you are aware of what they have done.

    I would try to let your temper cool a bit before contacting them. Mind you, I'm not capable of containing my temper, but if you can it would be best.

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    1. I have sent an email in the best form I can under the circumstances, I think I have kept my temper under control.

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  11. I see many images on the poster, not all are yours? Is Crisis a big commercial venture earning squillions or a smaller scale promotional tool for a "small hobby" we are all having fun in? Is a metal well painted miniature you, your bank account etc, hmmm no. Yep they should have asked permission and yep had they, you would have been rightly chuffed (I know I would be)but to go bounding in with Axe drawn may not be the most diplomatic way. So drop them a nice line with a "did you realise that....." and then ask them to ask for permission next time. Can't see them ripping you off on purpose, oh did you get ripped off?

    hope this hopes and no offense intended so please don't take any from my comment.

    cheers Chris

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    1. No offence taken, but just to confirm its not about money its about the polite and correct thing to do. As I have said before its a very personal image and used without my permission and is therefore a breach of copyright which is illegal.

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    2. Hi Andrew,
      totally agree with the illegality of the issue, polite and appropriate is the right thing to do and they did not do it. Sadly I feel that most of us have breech of copy right materials in our possession, or our kids do and though we may not be making money from them the intellectual copyright owners have not made the money. I am not justifying what the CRISIS team have done, it is just hard for me to throw stones as too many of us are in glass houses.
      Have you contacted the crisis people and asked for I) a reason and II) Your name to be recognised as owner of the image. I am sure they would be happy to recognise you in some form or another.

      A comment further on calls for commercial destruction of infringing materials and well does our hobby have to go this far???? Can't see Antwerp doing much bigger game conventions than Australia so I wonder if it would really hurt them??

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    3. Chris does have a point, though it's flimsy at best.

      I never like the , well they did not mean offence so it's not so bad.

      I really dislike the, we have done the same (or our kids) so they really are not doing something that's bad.

      Actually if they are not making a profit from said image, no financial recompense can be gained. Indeed it can go further, you would have to prove YOU have financially lost out to get some sort of financial return.

      All that said it would have been much better if they had sought out permission to use that image and I should imagine others but that's harder to do than just use. I myself have done the same thing with maps or images but purposely keep away from other painters painted figures.

      For me the crunch is that viewing the images I assume the organisation have some connection to said figure, the fact they have not is misleading at least and dishonest at worst.

      For you it's far more personal as it's you! it could have added a string to your bow but instead it's a bad taste in the mouth. Not sure any of us would feel different if it was our recognised image. Proof being another friend informing you of the use

      Ian

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  12. I know how you feel Andy.
    As you know, I had a similar problem last year with Items I had painted.
    These were been offered for sale on a website as painted by someone else.
    I did get this sorted, but it is annoying.

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  13. Absolutely understand and agree with your frustration and anger.
    To me it's another example of the internet making the work of people valueless (see also print journalism) - "oh it's free on the internet so why should I pay to use or access it" (or even in this case simply ask permission)?
    That's your work and they are exploiting it for commercial purposes. I'm sure they didn't intend to cause upset or irritation, and may have simply made a communications mistake, but neither of those is a defence.
    In the commercial field this kind of "error" would result in the company having to destroy all copies (at considerable cost and inconvenience) - you may not want to make them do that, but unless originators of content start to defend their rights in these cases other people will continue to exploit it for commercial gain.
    Good luck with getting some sort of resolution that suits you from this.
    Tom

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  14. Sadly it's not uncommon. I came across a painting commission group recently that were showcasing other people's models in their gallery. I wouldn't have noticed, except the standard and style was significantly different to the rest.

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  15. Hi Andrew,

    that was at least clumsy and I can absolutely understand that you're upset. The best way is to dispose the problem calmly.

    As far as I know the TSA they are hobbyists like you and me and kind guys. So I presume that they didn't mean any harm. Anyway some kind of excuse, concession and compansation is absolutely appropriate.

    Keep calm and good luck!

    Cheers
    Stefan

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  16. I reaction would be similar to yours Andrew in that I would be flattered, but at the same time quite upset they didn't ask me first and would drop them a polite line asking why.

    Christopher

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    1. Opps change the "I" to "My". I hate it when I make grammar errors which is all the darn time!

      Christopher

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  17. I say you and I crash this event; when is the next Concord flight?

    you've gotten plenty of good advice on this, the only thing I will reiterate even though I don't need to is, "Don't over react."

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  18. Failure to protect a copyright is also a bad thing, so to protect yourself, you had to respond to the error. On the other hand, the inclusion of the pic would do wonders for a painting service business.

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  19. Wow how fantastic hes on the poster but awful they didnt ask. He is an outstanding figure and regognition for the artist should have be given. Hope you get a reply and a public apology and some freebies. :)

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  20. Ithink you're well within your rights to drop them a line and express your disappointment and expectation of some form of recognition, compensation or for them to stop using your image to promote their show.

    I'd be interested in what they say.

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  21. Ooh , naughty....let them feel your ire, it would indeed be nice to be asked..

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  22. I have to concur with the common sentiment here. Copyright and IP are important. If it was educational and non-profit you might nudge them and let them know that they were naughty not asking you. As it is clearly commercial, then I think you have a strong case to challenge them (politely) and suggest that they a) acknowledge you on their material as the owner of the image and b) some form of recompense, however nominal.

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  23. I'm with you brother, just say the word and I'll have a ford granada with a couple of lads in donkey jackets around sharpish, let us know how they respond.

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  24. Wow, definitely some mixed feelings there. Neat to see that someone like you mini enough to use it for an advertisement, but you said shameful they didn't ask your permission first. I wish you luck on getting this resolved.

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  25. Definitely a bummer. I hope that they can do something to make it right.

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  26. I think this is morally as well as legally wrong. If it had occurred in a commercial environment, you cold take them to the cleaners, but I'm not sure what would constitute proper consideration here. You could take out an injunction (cease and desist), but so what? It's happened now, is unlikely to be repeated and is very likely to have been completely unintentional. Incompetence is no defence, but we're all friends here eh? In any case, if you were to go for them, you'd need to make sure your lawyer was a sharper operator then theirs or you'd end up footing the bill.

    No, I think you've taken the better course, but I'm with Fran. Having been born and bred in Salford, it's genetically my default setting. ;O)

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    1. Thank you to you all:

      I have now sent two sets of emails to the club contacts, one set yesterday and another set issued this morning I have given them until 9.30 am Monday to issue some form of response before I escalate matters further.

      I have found out that I can as a first course of action contact the hosting company and have the website shut down with immediate effect, for breach of copyright, so that is at least a starting point if I do not get a reply.

      I do intend to protect my rights on this matter, because of all my images this one is personal. That is not to say I wont allow the continued use for the event dependant on the reply I receive.

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  27. Im a bit surprised a big enterprise like this arent a tad more professional, its your work you should be credited, ometimes the flattery stops you responding but your right to think wait a minute Im a pro and seek a resolution

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  28. None of this namby pamby stuff, I'd get that axe out aaarrrrgggghhhh!

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  29. Andrew, Sorry to hear this. It is very unlike the guys from TSA not to have their stuff in order. I hope they react quickly and in a way that satisfies you. Of course, pissing you off and then inviting you to Crisis would be a terrific publicity stunt ;-)

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    1. I have received a reply and will be replying to it shortly. Everyone is entitled to make an error that is part of being human. The important matter is how any dispute is resolved

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  30. Just tuned for latest news on Lokigate, lets hope you come out with your model displayed still and recognition, a mention on their website n link maybe?

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    1. All in hand Matey just awaiting a reply to my reply from the chairman of TSA

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  31. I've been caught in things like this from both side - for example I used a map on my blog without permission once and got an email from the author, and have had a number of my photos used on commercial blogs without attribution. In virtually all cases a polite email apology has resolved things, and an attribution note has sufficed to calm any ruffled feathers.

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